Daniel chapters 8 and 11

Discuss world empires past, present, and future. What does the Bible say about the empires of the world?
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David
Posts: 132
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:38 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Daniel chapters 8 and 11

Post by David »

Hi again,

Some more thoughts regarding Daniels prophecy.

And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Revelation 17:10-11



I'm thinking that in Daniel we are told Nebuchad-nezzar is the first but who are the other 7? Read on in Daniel, Belshazzar is the second king spoken of then Darius. Now Darius can be a touchy subject as he is to many historians a huge unknown, why he is mentioned here when it was Cyrus who regiened is at the moment beyond me. But when I read the ENTIRE book of Daniel namely the Destruction of Bel and the Dragon it, for me atleast, re-enforces the idea that Darius and Cyrus are one and the same. For in that story it seems king Cyrus was the one who cast Daniel into the lions den.

Looking at Chapter 11 if I read it right there to be four more that rise up in Persia after 'Darius' (whom I believe to be Cyrus) which will come to the grand total of seven kings spoken of in Daniel. It is this seventh king which stirs up all against the Realm of Javan which I suspect includes Elisha, Dodanim, Kittim and Tarshish (Genisis 10 ). In chapter 8 we read this battle happens at the time of the end when the seventh Persian king causes Javan (the goat in chapter 8 ) to move against the kings of Media and Persia (the ram chapter 8 ) and beat them down like a rag doll.

From this battle according to chapter 8 a little horn rises up in it's aftermath. In Chapter 11 we see the same battle spoken of but in greater detail. As not only does it tell you it is the seventh king that stirs up all against the Realm of Javan. It goes into some detail of the aftermath all the way up to the vile king, whom I believe we would agree as to being the little horn. From what I gathered I think the time between the seventh king and the vile king in Chapter 12 is what is described in chapter 8 as the time of the transgressors.

Again I don't think there is gap between the 3rd and fourth kingdoms. Mainly due to my thought there will not be a thrird temple built by Jew or Gentile. As the only reference I find to another temple being constructed is one built by our King.

Anyways what it boils down to for me is Alexanders Empire has nothing to do with Daniels prophecy. Has the Realm of Javan been stirred yet? I don't know. If it hasn't yet maybe when Javan comes against Perisa the aftermath a.k.a. the time of the transgressors speaks of a time when there will be a united Islamic Union with a line of Caliphs.


P.S. To some here, because Bel and the Dragon is in the Apocrphya some may think me the boogie man. But the translators of the 1611 edition thought it important enough to include in the Bible because of it's historical significance. Which why I read it to further my understanding.

Also these kings and nations spoken of in the Bible are really more families than bordered nations. My thought is the entire Bible is a family affair, and we all know how family relations can be sometimes. But the problems between Israel and Ishmael is on a much grander scale.

One must remember we are all decendents of the sons of Noah. To help understand where these (our) families migrated to there is a source I like to refer too sometimes http://www.soundchristian.com/man/ Take it for what it's worth.

One more thing I was just thinking right after I logged off that maybe the seventy week period spoken of in Daniel refers to the time of the transgressors after the battle between the Ram and the Goat. Just a thought...
David
Posts: 132
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:38 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: Daniel chapters 8 and 11

Post by David »

Hi again,

Some more thoughts regarding Daniels prophecy.

And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space. And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

Revelation 17:10-11



I'm thinking that in Daniel we are told Nebuchad-nezzar is the first but who are the other 7? Read on in Daniel, Belshazzar is the second king spoken of then Darius. Now Darius can be a touchy subject as he is to many historians a huge unknown, why he is mentioned here when it was Cyrus who regiened is at the moment beyond me. But when I read the ENTIRE book of Daniel namely the Destruction of Bel and the Dragon it, for me atleast, re-enforces the idea that Darius and Cyrus are one and the same. For in that story it seems king Cyrus was the one who cast Daniel into the lions den.

Looking at Chapter 11 if I read it right there to be four more that rise up in Persia after 'Darius' (whom I believe to be Cyrus) which will come to the grand total of seven kings spoken of in Daniel. It is this seventh king which stirs up all against the Realm of Javan which I suspect includes Elisha, Dodanim, Kittim and Tarshish (Genisis 10 ). In chapter 8 we read this battle happens at the time of the end when the seventh Persian king causes Javan (the goat in chapter 8 ) to move against the kings of Media and Persia (the ram chapter 8 ) and beat them down like a rag doll.

From this battle according to chapter 8 a little horn rises up in it's aftermath. In Chapter 11 we see the same battle spoken of but in greater detail. As not only does it tell you it is the seventh king that stirs up all against the Realm of Javan. It goes into some detail of the aftermath all the way up to the vile king, whom I believe we would agree as to being the little horn. From what I gathered I think the time between the seventh king and the vile king in Chapter 11 is what is described in chapter 8 as the time of the transgressors.

Again I don't think there is gap between the 3rd and fourth kingdoms. Mainly due to my thought there will not be a thrird temple built by Jew or Gentile. As the only reference I find to another temple being constructed is one built by our King.

Anyways what it boils down to for me is Alexanders Empire has nothing to do with Daniels prophecy. Has the Realm of Javan been stirred yet? I don't know. If it hasn't yet maybe when Javan comes against Perisa the aftermath a.k.a. the time of the transgressors speaks of a time when there will be a united Islamic Union with a line of Caliphs.


P.S. To some here, because Bel and the Dragon is in the Apocrphya some may think me the boogie man. But the translators of the 1611 edition thought it important enough to include in the Bible because of it's historical significance. Which why I read it to further my understanding.

Also these kings and nations spoken of in the Bible are really more families than bordered nations. My thought is the entire Bible is a family affair, and we all know how family relations can be sometimes. But the problems between Israel and Ishmael is on a much grander scale.

One must remember we are all decendents of the sons of Noah. To help understand where these (our) families migrated to there is a source I like to refer too sometimes http://www.soundchristian.com/man/ Take it for what it's worth.

One more thing I was just thinking right after I logged off that maybe the seventy week period spoken of in Daniel refers to the time of the transgressors after the battle between the Ram and the Goat. Just a thought ...
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